Īntoarcerea la Ortodoxie

Lumina Sfanta e de aproape 2000 de ani , inainte ca Apocalipsa sa fie scrisa. Se spune ca insusi Apostolul Petru a vazut-o.
"The first writtenaccount of the Holy Fire (Holy Light) dates from the fourth century, but authors write about events that occurred in the first century. So Ss. John Damascene and Gregory of Nissa narrate how the Apostle Peter saw the Holy Light in the Holy Sepulchre after Christ's resurrection. "One can trace the miracle throughout the centuries in the many itineraries of the Holy Land." The Russian abbot Daniel, in his itinerary written in the years 1106-07, presents the "Miracle of the Holy Light" and the ceremonies that frame it in a very detailed manner. He recalls how the Patriarch goes into the Sepulchre-chapel (the Anastasis) with two candles. The Patriarch kneels in front of the stone on which Christ was laid after his death and says certain prayers, at which point the miracle occurs. Light proceeds from the core of the stone - a blue, indefinable light which after some time kindles unlit oil lamps as well as the Patriarch's two candles. This light is "The Holy Fire", and it spreads to all people present in the Church. The ceremony surrounding "The Miracle of the Holy Fire" may be the oldest unbroken Christian ceremony in the world. From the fourth century A.D. all the way up to our own time, sources recall this awe-inspiring event. From these sources it becomes clear that the miracle has been celebrated on the same spot, on the same feast day, and in the same liturgical frame throughout all these centuries.[2]

Every time heterodox have tried to obtain the Holy Fire they have failed. Three such attempts are known. Two occured in the twelfth century when priests of the Roman church tried to force out the Orthodox church but by their own confession these ended with God's punishment. [3,4] But the most miraculous event occured in the year 1579, the year when God clearly testified to whom alone may be given His miracle.

"Once the Armenians (monophysites - ed.) paid the Turks, who then occupied the Holy Land, in order to obtain permission for their Patriarch to enter the Holy Sepulchre, the Orthodox Patriarch was standing sorrowfully with his flock at the exit of the church, near the left column, when the Holy Light split this column vertically and flashed near the Orthodox Patriarch.

A Muslim Muezzin, called Tounom, who saw the miraculous event from an adjacent mosque, immediately abandoned the Muslim religion and became an Orthodox Christian. This event took place in 1579 under Sultan Mourad IV, when the Patriarch of Jerusalem was Sophrony IV.(The above mentioned split column still exists. It dates from the twelfth century. The Orthodox pilgrims embrace it at the "place of the split" as they enter the church).[2, date and name are corrected]

Turkish warriors stood on the wall of a building close to the gate and lightning-struck column . When he saw this striking miracle he cried that Christ is truly God and leaped down from a height of about ten meters. But he was not killed-the stones under him became as soft as wax and his footprint was left upon them. The Turks tried to scrape away these prints but they could not destroy them; so they remain as witnesses [5].

He was burned by the Turks near the Church. His remains, gathered by the Greeks, lay in the monastery of Panagia until the 19th century shedding chrism.

Muslims, who deny the Passion, Crucifixion and Resurrection of Christ, tried to put obstacles in the way of the miracle. Well known Muslim historian Al Biruni wrote: "? a (note: Muslim) governor brought a copper wire instead of a wick (note: for the self lighting oil lamps), in order that it wouldn't ignite and the whole thing would fail to occur. But as the fire descended, the copper burned."[6]

This was not the only attempt. The report written by the English chronicler, Gautier Vinisauf, describes what happened in the year 1192.

"In 1187, the Saracens under the direction of Sultan Salah ad-Din took Jerusalem. In that year, the Sultan desired to be present at the celebration, even though he was not a Christian. Gautier Vinisauf tells us what happened: "On his arrival, the celestial fire descended suddenly, and the assistants were deeply moved...the Saracens... said that the fire which they had seen to come down was produced by fraudulent means. Salah ad-Din, wishing to expose the imposter, caused the lamp, which the fire from Heaven had lighted, to be extinguished, but the lamp relit immediately. He caused it to be extinguished a second time and a third time, but it relit as of itself. Thereupon, the Sultan, confounded, cried out in prophetic transport: 'Yes, soon shall I die, or I shall lose Jerusalem.'"[7]


A miracle that is unknown in the West
One can ask the question of why the miracle of the Holy Fire is almost unknown in Western Europe. In Protestant areas it may, to a certain extent, be explained by the fact that there is no real tradition of miracles; people don't really know in which box to place the miracles, and they rarely feature in newspapers. But in the Catholic tradition there is vast interest in miracles. Thus, why is it not more well known? For this only one explanation suffices: Church politics. Only the Orthodox Churches attend the ceremony which is centered on the miracle. It only occurs on the Orthodox date of Easter and without the presence of any Catholic authorities.[2]


The question of the authenticity of the miracle
As with any other miracle there are people who believe it is a fraud and nothing but a masterpiece of Orthodox propaganda. They believe the Patriarch has a lighter inside of the tomb. These critics, however, are confronted with a number of problems. Matches and other means of ignition are recent inventions. Only a few hundred years ago lighting a fire was an undertaking that lasted much longer than the few minutes during which the Patriarch is inside the tomb. One then could perhaps say, he had an oil lamp burning inside, from which he kindled the candles, but the local authorities confirmed that they had checked the tomb and found no light inside it.

The best arguments against a fraud, however, are not the testimonies of the shifting Patriarchs. The biggest challenges confronting the critics are the thousands of independent testimonies by pilgrims whose candles were lit spontaneously in front of their eyes without any possible explanation. According to our investigations, it has never been possible to film any of the candles or oil lamps igniting by themselves. However, I am in the possession of a video filmed by a young engineer from Bethlehem, Souhel Nabdiel. Mr. Nabdiel has been present at the ceremony of the Holy Fire since his early childhood. In 1996 he was asked to film the ceremony from the balcony of the dome of the Church. Present with him on the balcony were a nun and four other believers. The nun stood at the right hand of Nabdiel. On the video one can see how he films down on the crowds. At a certain point all lights are turned off - it is time for the Patriarch to enter the tomb and receive the Holy Fire. While he is still inside the tomb one suddenly hears a scream of surprise and wonder originating from the nun standing next to Nabdiel. The camera begins to shake, as one hears the excited voices of the other people present on the balcony. The camera now turns to the right, whereby it is possible to contemplate the cause of the commotion. A big candle, held in the hand of the Russian nun, takes fire in front of all the people present before the patriarch comes out of the tomb. She holds the candle with shaking hands while making the sign of the Cross over and over again in awe of the miracle she has witnessed. This video appears to be the closest one gets to an actual filming of the miracle.

"

Edited by Dimineata100, 12 December 2008 - 13:55.

Since Constantine the Great built The Holy Sepulchre Church in the middle of the fourth century, the church has been destroyed many times. The Crusaders constructed the church that we see today. Around Jesus' tomb was erected a little chapel with two rooms, one little room in front of the tomb and the tomb itself, which holds no more than four people. It is this chapel that is the centre of the miraculous events.

Biserica pe locul in care a inviat IIsus e descrisa aici:in wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calvary



In another of the many testimonies, Archimedes Pendaki of Athens, Greece, reports that the experience of the miracle became the impetus that eventually led him to become an Orthodox priest. Father Pendaki experienced the miracle in 1983. In the preceeding years, he had drifted further and further away from the Orthodox faith of his family, and only rarely did he enter a church.

His mother, who was very religious, convinced him after much arguing to come to Jerusalem and witness the Miracle of the Holy Fire. While mother and son were standing in the Holy Sepulchre Church it so happened that the candle of Pendaki's mother lighted spontaneously before their eyes.

Archimedes at first raged at her, accusing her of trickery to make him believe, but deep inside he knew very well that she would never invent such a thing. Furthermore she was not able to produce the portent herself. The event continued to disturb his thoughts until he could not ignore it any more, and the need to explore the faith of his youth in depth led him to the Holy Mountain of Athos. After some years, he decided to become a priest.

In the year 2000, the blue flame again lighted the candles of many people. According to Archbishop Alexios, a monk was standing close to the door of the sepulchre. While the patriarch was still inside the tomb, the monk received the flame on his candle to the great astonishment of the people standing around him. From his candle, the fire spread on the side of the tomb.

A young man from the Greek island of Rhodos testified that he saw the fire coming as a cloud above the monk, descending to light his candles.

Edited by Dimineata100, 12 December 2008 - 14:42.

E important ca protestantii sa se intoarca la ortodoxie .

Dimineata100, on Feb 6 2009, 15:16, said:

eu zic ..

mai bine sa se intoarca toti la SCRIPTURI ..nu la povesti si basme babesti ,...

Intoarcerea la scripturi si la interpretarile pe care le-au dat Parintii Bisericii care au stabilit si canonul Bibliei vezi Homiliile Sfantului Ioan Gura De Aur, nu la reinterpretarile protestante 30000 care nu vorbesc acelasi lucru.

Dimineata100, on Feb 7 2009, 09:29, said:

sa se intoarca la FAPTELE APOSTOLILOR ...la invatatura sanatoasa apostolica ...nu la aiurelile lui CRISOSTOMUL (I.GURA de aur )FILOZOF GREC ....care habar nu a avut de SCRIPTURI ...si de REVELATIA UNICULUI DUMNEZEU ATOTPUTERNIC !

http://en.wikipedia....ohn_Chrysostom:
"Saint John Chrysostom (c. 347?407, Greek: ??????? ? ???????????), archbishop of Constantinople, was an important Early Church Father. He is known for his eloquence in preaching and public speaking, his denunciation of abuse of authority by both ecclesiastical and political leaders, the Divine Liturgy of St. John Chrysostom, and his ascetic sensibilities. After his death (or, according to some sources, during his life) he was given the Greek surname chrysostomos, meaning "golden mouthed", rendered in English as Chrysostom.[2][1]"

Ioan Gura De Aur a fost Episcop al Constantinopolelui si importanta persoana in Biserica care a dat Biblia. Cineva a spus ca a vazut cum Apostolul Pavel ii talmacea Scriptuta cand scria homiliile. Asta se numeste revelatie.

Deci inca odata intoarcerea la scripturi si la interpretarea corecta a scripturilor interpretare conforma cu LEGEA CEA NOUA data de IIsus Dumnezeu intrupat. Nu intamplator Lumina Sfanta

Trebuie sa fugim de cele 30000 interpretari protestante care se bat cap in cap. Eu cred ca in multe aspecte (re)interpretarile protestante sunt inventii . De exemplu unii protestanti au (re)interpretat la 1400+ ani de la inceputul crestinismului ca botezul trebuie facut doar la adulti desi in documentele istorice vedem ca la inceput copiii erau botezati.

Edited by Dimineata100, 07 February 2009 - 18:23.

Dimineata100, on Feb 7 2009, 09:29, said:

Niste nemernici pacatosi care calca Legea lui Dumnezeu fara rusine!

2 Peter 1

20Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.


Una scrie, alta fac acesti netrebnici!

Intoarcerea la Scriptura is la interpretarea ce a fost revelata parintilor Bisericii.

overseas, on Dec 10 2008, 14:19, said:

O minune la indemana oricui este aghiasma. De ce nu se strica? Du-te la orice biserica si vezi cum se face si afla motivul pentru catr sta proaspata  zeci de ani. Oare asta nu e o minune? Ai putea spune ca preotii pun ceva in ea conservant etc, dar vezi ca sunt preoti care fac sfestania la rau si oamenii iau apa direct din rau si nu se strica. Mergi la Iordan si vezi ce se intampla acolo in fiecare an de boboteaza. Sunt semne irelevante doar pentru cei care refuza sa le accepte!

Dimineata100, on Feb 7 2009, 18:13, said:

Am mai intrebat dar nu am primit raspuns. Poti sa-mi arati si mie un comentariu expozitiv al intregii Biblii, verset cu verset, facut de Hrisostom ? Asta pentru inceput.
'Cineva a spus... ca a vazut...' tare imi pare rau de tot ce e bun in ortodoxie, dar e ingropat adanc de superstitii si povesti babesti. Aveti Biblia care va poate da intelepciune pentru viata vesnica, dar daca va luati dupa povesti inchipuite va fi vai de voi.
Apoi, daca Hrisostom a primit revelatie, locul lui este in canon, in Scriptura. De ce nu ati modificat canonul.
Biserica ortodoxa nu a dat Biblia, cei care au scris-o nu au fost ortodocsi ca si confesiune. Asta e propaganda.
Din cele 3000 de interpretari, vreo 2000 nu se bat cap in cap, ci sunt in acord in punctele esentiale de doctrina. Ce parere ai ?
Protestantii nu promoveaza botezul adultilor, ci botezul persoanelor constiente si doritoare. Sesizezi diferenta ?

jeremiah, on Feb 7 2009, 17:58, said:

Prietene, nu stiu eu cat stii tu despre Sfantul Ioan Hrisostom (Gura de Aur), dar te sfatuiesc sa-l citesti si sa mergi la manastirea Vatopedi de la M. Athos si sa-i vezi moastele! ...si sa-i citesti minunile savarsite!

ionut27, on Feb 11 2009, 11:23, said:

Manastirea Agigadar din Suceava, facatoare de minuni, pe care o inconjuram in genunchi cand eram ortodox, a ars lovita de traznet. Te intreb, a fost un semn divin sau nu ?
Eu iau apa de la un izvor din muntii Lotrului, apa este extraordinar de pura (pe baza analizei de laborator), ramane rece chiar daca o tii in casa si nu strica saptamani in sir. Este sau nu vreun semn divin ?
Daca iti arat minuni mai mari la budisti sau la guru indieni, te vei inchina lor sau nu ? Minunile conteaza mai mult decat litera Bibliei sau nu ?


http://ro.wikipedia....tirea_Hagigadar

Dimineata100, on Feb 7 2009, 18:13, said:

la inceput numai adultii erau botezati. botezul copiilor a fost introdus mai tarziu. zii care interpretari se bat cap in cap. fie vorba intre noi, uite'te la slujba bin biserica ortodoxa si zi'mi ce legatura mai are cu Biblia sau cu slujbele vechilor crestini

Edited by danut21, 11 February 2009 - 11:47.

overseas, on Feb 11 2009, 11:35, said:

e o deosebire ca o apa sa tina saptamani iar aceeasi apa sfintita sa tina ani!
In legatura cu minunile indienilor si budistior, iti recomand 2 carti pe care te rog daca ai timp sa le citesti: "Minuni si false minuni"- Mihail Urzica si "Mari initiati ai Indiei si Parintele Paisie"- Dyonysios Farasiotis . Cea de-a doua este scrisa de un yogin convertit la Ortodoxie.
PS: Accept comentarii numai de la cei ce le-au citit!

ionut27, on Feb 11 2009, 11:47, said:

Defineste ce inseamna sa se 'strice' apa. Organizeaza un experiment in acest sens sub egida BOR, cu oameni de stiinta si jurnalisti care sa verifice. Apoi mai vorbim.
O sa tin si eu apa de izvor 1 an sa vedem ce se intampla si te anunt.
Pe aia cu Paisie am citit-o. In fenomene similare am fost si eu implicat, prin artele martiale. Dumnezeu m-a mantuit prin predicarea unui evanghelist si prin citirea Bibliei.

Citeste cartea unui guru autentic indian convertit la protestantism: http://en.wikipedia....ki/Rabi_Maharaj

Si Agidagarul, cum ramane cu Agigadarul !?

Edited by overseas, 11 February 2009 - 11:54.

overseas, on Feb 11 2009, 11:52, said:

Tine niste apa de la robinet intr-o sticla si ai sa vezi cum in cateva zile se inverzeste si capata si un miros urat. Acelasi lucru se va intampla si cu cea de izvor, dar dupa un timp mai indelungat.

In legatura cu manastirea armeana arsa de fulger ce pot sa-ti spun? Un fenomen al naturii! Si eu cand am fost la Muntele Athos, la Manastirea Prodromu a fost o furtuna iar un trasnet a lovit un chiparos care a ars ca o lumanare la cativa metri de biserica. Din fericire calugarii l-au stins la timp. De retinut este faptul ca, calugarii nu sunt niste sfinti, ci ei tind spre sfintenie. Unii dintre ei ajung la ea. Asta nu inseamna ca nu sunt supusi ispitelor si incercarilor. Dumnezeu are judecati diferite si modalitati de a incerca un om. Poate prin necazul abatut asupra lor se vor intari in credinta, se vor ruga mai fierbinte si se vor apropia mai mult de Dumnezeu. Asa cum se intampla si cu noi: cand suntem bine, nu avem nevoie de Dumnezeu, insa cand apare o problema, o boala in familie, atunci mergem la Biserica.

Edited by ionut27, 11 February 2009 - 12:15.

ionut27, on Feb 11 2009, 12:12, said:

Deci cand apar semne pozitive trebuie sa le interpretam in favoarea autoritatii ortodoxe, cand apar semne distructive trebuie sa le ignoram. Daca zici tu