Solaris

Cine poate să-mi explice simbolistica din final? Chris  se întoarce acasă, privește înăuntru pe fereastră și vede cum plouă înăuntru pe cărți și pe Nik - tatăl lui.

The ending to Solaris is pretty clear if you follow the literary cues throughout the film. At the dinner party they discuss the idea of God and Rhea (named after the Greek Goddess, the “mother of the Gods”) becomes upset with his atheism, apropos the concept of the afterlife. It is clear that he is swallowed up by Solaris, but they don’t imply that he “died”. The entire movie is in a suspension, a purgatory. Assuming that the last part is part of the afterlife only fits in with the grander stage of the metaphor. He couldn’t resolve his relationship with Rhea on Earth or purgatory (the land of ghosts) because Rhea outside of Solaris was nothing but a facsimile of her essence based on his perception. Assuming Solaris is a metaphor for a platonic God, which is suggested many times, there are mentions of its omniscience, Rhea inside Solaris would be the quintessence of Rhea. The last scene is the afterlife, they will live forever (the cut finger heals). Stanislov Lem is known for his philosophical and existential theories, and this is very apparent in Solaris. When seen through this tradition, the story is actually quite elegant, literal and succinct.”

ce nu e clar ?

sirgoofy, on 08 iulie 2017 - 14:47, said:

Ce simbolizează ploaia din casă, aia nu e clar.

inundatie de la vecinu...

pentru motivul ploii a se vedea satantango a lui bela tarr care da clasa lui tarky...

Poate cineva să-mi ofere un răspuns (altul decât miștouri sau emoticoane)?
Am putea trece la miștouri după, accept cu plăcere.
Mulțumesc

Edited by rebroff, 08 July 2017 - 17:20.

rebroff, on 08 iulie 2017 - 14:15, said:

Incearca aici, poate te ajuta cu ceva:
https://books.google...mbolism&f=false

De regula, ploaia uneste cerul cu pamântul, sterge pacatele si este un fel de reînnoire a vietii.

Pe unele forumuri am găsit câteva opinii pe tema asta, dar nu prea sunt mulțumit. Sunt posibile explicații tehnice mai degrabă, ori eu caut cheia metaforică.

1. The rain inside the house means nothing... Solaris is making a reproduction of earth from the subconscious of Kris. But it doesn't knows that rain shouldn't fall inside the house. The reproduction isn't perfect.
It is clear to me that the scene with the father is redemption.
2. This image, water/rain inside buildings, is a common image for Tarkovsky. It is found in nearly all his films. A possible explanation for it in Solaris is that it identifies the house as a creation of the alien consciousness on the planet. Throughout the film, this "intelligence" is not always accurate in its representations. An example would be Hari's dress, which has buttons but cannot be unbuttoned, and Hari herself, who has factual memories, but not the emotions normally associated with such memories. The rain inside the house could be another mistake the alien makes.
3. The last scene where it's raining inside the house. The ocean downloaded the memory from Kris' mind but recreated the virtual reality imperfectly. Hence the rain is falling indoors and not outside.

Întreaga secvență de la final am considerat-o un fel de imagine în oglindă a începutului filmului. Suprafața lacului, prim-planul cu Hari (din față/din spate), ploaia care cădea în exterior/interior. L-am văzut cu mulți ani în urmă, probabil că nu îmi amintesc toate detaliile.

Uite o interpretare care raspunde întrebării tale - vezi si comentariile:

Sudden inexplicable rains are often standard visual symbols of epiphany, moments of beautiful recollections of love and passion, seemingly baptised by external, sublime forces.  The rains appear without warning early in Solaris when Kris is spending his last day on Earth before his space trip. Astute viewers will note that it occurs after the statement "I don't care for new things". Water pours within the space station in a bath space after Kris tells Hari version 2 why he left Hari behind, evidently after a quarrel, when he was transferred in his job on Earth. Rains appear again as Kris dreams of connecting with his father on an island on planet Solaris: this time the rain falls within the house wetting his father's clothes. The rains are not real but serve as a metaphor to underscore the sublime and emotional connection with the characters and the scene.

http://moviessansfro...ovskys.html?m=1

"...prim-planul cu Hari".  Scuze, mă refeream la Kris.

Edited by octav727, 10 July 2017 - 00:19.

octav727, on 09 iulie 2017 - 22:49, said:

Da, interesant, mulțumesc. Totuși în acel final ploaia cade nu doar pe hainele tatălui ci și, în cadre destul de lungi, pe cărți. Asta e ceea ce m-ar interesa în principal: care e semnificația ploii căzând pe cărți?

Am gasit o mica explicatie a regizorului: "There is always water in my films. I like water, especially brooks. The sea is too vast. I don't fear it; it is just monotonous. In nature I like smaller things. Microcosm, not macrocosm; limited surfaces. I love the Japanese attitude to nature. They concentrate on a confined space reflecting the infinite. Water is a mysterious element -- because of its structure. And it is very cinegenic; it transmits movement, depth, changes. Nothing is more beautiful than water."
http://nofilmschool....there-symbolism

Ultima scenă: Îngenuncherea în faţa tatălui la întoarcerea fiului rătăcit în (altă) lume.

[ https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/93/Rembrandt_Harmensz_van_Rijn_-_Return_of_the_Prodigal_Son_-_Google_Art_Project.jpg/1200px-Rembrandt_Harmensz_van_Rijn_-_Return_of_the_Prodigal_Son_-_Google_Art_Project.jpg - Pentru incarcare in pagina (embed) Click aici ]


Tabloul lui Rembrandt este expus la Muzeul Ermitage, deci Tarkovski îl va fi privit nu o singură dată pe acest Fiu risipitor.
Imaginaţi-vă că acele fire de ploaie sunt lacrimile lui, întoarse pe dinăuntru, ca tot ce este re-construit (metaforic) de Oceanul gânditor.

Şi amintiţi-vă şi de primele scene, de DESPĂRŢIREA pe care Kris şi-o asumase ştiind prea bine că rătăcirea / rispirea lui înspre Cosmos nu-i va îngădui vreodată să-şi regăsească părintele.

Nu întâmplător asta e proiecţia (de căinţă şi dor perpetuu) pe care Oceanul gânditor i-o dăruieşte.

Şi muzica de final. Nimic sacru, nimic tandru, nimic înălţător (precum Bach), ci un vuiet sinistru, înfricoşător, însingurat.

E preţul cunoaşterii-de-sine.

[ https://www.youtube-nocookie.com/embed/Jorf-2o5YfU?feature=oembed - Pentru incarcare in pagina (embed) Click aici ]

Edited by Naoto, 30 July 2017 - 17:28.